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Post by jdpaint on Apr 23, 2016 6:29:08 GMT -5
MR Millers reply :" I was told nothing of ythis amendment and at this point can not support it."
I do believe you did know of the amendments.Either way ,why are you not on board with state wide cables?Gaining more support than ever but you balk at it?
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Post by nightstalker1 on Apr 23, 2016 7:08:41 GMT -5
I don't know all the history of the cable restraints either......BUT
This would be a great time for our new NYSTA president MR. Hogan to post on here and respond to all the questions, confusion & clear the air
In the past, John Rockwood has posted on this forum to give his views and any NYSTA goals when he was president.
This forum can be used as a tool to get the NYSTA ideas / goals out to MORE trappers
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Post by johnrockwood on Apr 23, 2016 7:11:18 GMT -5
It would be amiss for anyone on the NYSTA voting board to make any statements on this controversial issue until all the facts are known. Far too many on the Board didn't even know that the bill had been changed. Almost all of us were blind sided by this, including Dave Miller.
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wcs
Posts: 1,159
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Post by wcs on Apr 23, 2016 8:19:14 GMT -5
Well I guess we'll have to see how the bill does eh JD? If it dies then I guess Dave Miller was correct. My first instinct is to trust NYSTA. What I fail to understand is the old bill sat in committee for over 5 years with no movement at all.......none. Is that not a dead bill? In fact, the sponsor of the old bill was was pulling the bill, meaning he was cancelling his attempt at making CR legal anywhere. There is a lot to this story.
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Post by trappermac on Apr 23, 2016 8:36:09 GMT -5
Gets more confusing with every post. Somebody needs to clarify ASAP. If this amended bill stands a chance over the previous version it's losing support due to indecisiveness. My greatest fear is that this mess is a result of jealousy or some type of power struggle. Not good.
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Post by flatiron on Apr 23, 2016 9:08:50 GMT -5
Mac, this bill has less chance of moving than the previous bill. Mr. Redknot knows this now as well. Each year a bill fails to move I believe its resubmitted . I haven't seen redsnot post anything as of late and it's doubtful we will here from Ed Hogan either. This situation has been a crushing blow to the original bill considering the time and effort spent . JD paint , I know you as a pretty level headed individual but feel you are way off base on this one . Propaganda has a way of swaying many.
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wcs
Posts: 1,159
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Post by wcs on Apr 23, 2016 9:09:39 GMT -5
Just to clarify, the new bill in the assembly is a brand new bill, with a new author and a bunch of new co sponsors. The old bill that included only the NZ was pulled or cancelled by the author. If not for the new bill currently in the assembly environment committee, there would be no bill at all as far as I know.
In the Senate, the old bill that was voted on and passed several times over the past 5 years, is still in place. However, it has been amended to match the current bill in the Assembly to allow CR statewide. The Seante is in favor of CR and always have been.
Politics aside, and I have no dog in this fight, the new bill in the Assembly has more support from assembly members than the old bill ever had. I don't mean to offend anyone, and I have no idea who knew what and when.
It seems to me that the biggest hurdle with the new bill, as it was for the old bill, is getting the bill moved out of the committee to the assembly for a vote. The chair of the committee has a ton of power and basically makes the decision as to what moves and what does not.
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Post by trappermac on Apr 23, 2016 9:22:02 GMT -5
WCS.....and whom do you represent and what is your involvement in the new bill? I don't know everyone on here but if your intent is to clarify, then I'd like to know on whose behalf you do so.
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Post by nightstalker1 on Apr 23, 2016 9:55:27 GMT -5
WCS.....and whom do you represent and what is your involvement in the new bill? I don't know everyone on here but if your intent is to clarify, then I'd like to know on whose behalf you do so. Good point Mac For the record, I'm involved with the trapping / NYSTA group ONLY
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wcs
Posts: 1,159
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Post by wcs on Apr 23, 2016 10:06:29 GMT -5
I got involved when I called my assembly member James Skoufis to talk to him about the CR bill that was sitting in the committee for so long without movement. He looked into the matter and informed me (much to my surprise) that the bill was being withdrawn. Skoufis agreed to draft new legistlation with Assemblywoman Gunther (who sits on the environmental committee). Prior to them creating the new bill, Assemblyman Magee drafted his own bill, the new bill that includes the whole state. I have no idea who was dealing with Magee.
I did receive PMs from Redknot. I did not know he was an "enemy" of NYSTA. I don't know him or what his agendas are. He basically just said I was doing good work and making a difference. Truth? Lies? I have no idea.
But to answer your question, I represent no one. I am a member of NYSTA. I was just trying to clarify the facts of the new bill as I know them to be. I would like to use CR where I live and made inquires as to the status of the bill. My assemblyman has been very informative and open to me. Like I said earlier, I have no dog in this fight.
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Post by Dave Miller on Apr 23, 2016 14:35:18 GMT -5
A while back, in March I think, I received call from a member of the Fish and wildlife management Board (FWMB). He told me that they wanted to make this a state wide bill and did not understand why it was not done that way in the first place. I explained to him that the language restricting crs to the Northern Zone was at the request of the Chair of the Committee on Environmental Conservation, and that was the only way that the bill would be considered. After discussing this with then President Rockwood and others I agreed to that language feeling that for a couple of years half a loaf was bettr than none. The bill called for a two year sunset and at that time would be re done as state wide legislation. I explained to him that of course our intent was that crs should be available to trappers state wide and that I felt confident that would be the case in a couple of years once the bill was passed. NYSTA's goal s always been state wide. It has however also been our goal to move the bill and again I remind you that the committee chair has always said that he would only move it if it included this provision. I said that the only way that I would ask for a change was with an ok from the committee chair who by the way is assemblyman Steve Englebright. I,ve been in touch with Mr. Englebright's staff several times since this came about and have not had any encouragement yet. I have not had an opportunity to speak with him personally yet but his legislative aide tells me he is "less than enthusiastic" about it. At the end of my conversation with the FWMB member I thought that he understood the reason for my position; conversation over. No one ever contacted me again. I heard nothing more until April 8 when the bill showed up on my computer as amended and due to past history I opposed the amendment. Now I tell you that the new sponsor Mr .Magee is a great gentleman and a long time friend of mine and a friend of sportsmen. He has been around for a long time and Mr. Englebright's staff tells me that Mr. Magee is asking that the bill be done. Can he make this happen? I don't know. He is a powerful legislator so maybe. I will assure you of this, if I am told that Mr. Englebright is willing to do this bill I will absolutely support it no matter that I am angry about the way that it was done. My first and only obligation is to NYSTA and I will support NYSTAnd our members first always. .
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Post by markg on Apr 23, 2016 15:36:01 GMT -5
Mr. Miller thank you for the info and for all that that you have done. I for one appriciate all your efforts
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Post by jdpaint on Apr 23, 2016 15:48:03 GMT -5
Mr.Miller sure am glad to see you are considering supporting the bill. You have power and seems nysta members are very loyal and waiting on your word.Ive been told many times you are very good at what you do in Albany,I hope you can find a way to support it.
Well written WCS.
MR Miller / WCS , I received an email from the assemblyman stating he has concerns with the election in Long Island last week in which it may turn the Senate over to a Democratic control and getting anything done will be tough.Any thoughts ,ideas ,game plans on this ?
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Post by trappermac on Apr 23, 2016 17:41:28 GMT -5
WCS....thanks for the response, I commend your efforts. It appears you had the best interest of trappers in mind and nothing else from what I read.
Dave..thank you for stating the facts and for hopefully continuing to drive this bill through. Making the best of a situation that went off the tracks and continual support of CR's is in all trappers best interest.
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Post by erict on Apr 24, 2016 19:31:37 GMT -5
No, AJ, the Conservation Council screwed us, again! Actually this time the person contacting the legislators to change this bill said he represented the FWMB, as per what was reported at the NYSTA BOD Meeting. The FWMB primary function is to promote access for sportsmen on private lands. Why they would become involved in this issue is beyond me. I received this forwarded e-mail from Schenectady County Conservation Council last night - it appears NYSCC Fur Resources Committee may be behind the new bills: "From: Jim Petreszyn Subject: Cable Restraint bills amended I wanted to update the NYSCC on the issue of Cable Restraints. After working with Assemblyman Magee’s Office on the Assembly version and Senator Ortt’s Office on the Senate version, we now have companion bills which would make a live cable restraints a legal devices in NYS and allow the NYS DEC to regulate their use nearly State-wide. A-9462a and S-2953c Please pass this information to our members and ask that they reach out to their State Representatives for support of these bills. Thank you, Jim Petreszyn – Chairman, NYSCC Fur Resources Committee"
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Post by walleyed on Apr 24, 2016 20:02:38 GMT -5
COMMITTEE ?
This is the same One Man Committee That Packed it In Our Shorts with His unilateral Support of The Draft Fisher Management Plan, and we all know what a great deal the Original draft was for We Trappers.
Once Again Proving to us that the NYSCC and This Alleged Fur Resources "Committee" is NO Friend of The New York State Trapper.
All In my Opinion, of Course.
walleyed
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Post by jdpaint on Apr 25, 2016 18:14:21 GMT -5
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Post by whartonrattrapper on Apr 26, 2016 8:25:29 GMT -5
I'm with JD on this one...I'd be very surprised if Magee doesn't have the power to push this through.
Seems to me since the other bill went nowhere for years it's worth a shot to get behind this and show solidarity among us trappers.
Although I have to question some of the wording in the bill, especially this....
"Cable restraints are effective in all weather conditions and are not as susceptible to the freeze-thaw conditions of the Northern Zone."
This really cracks me up. Unless you're in the heart of the Adirondacks the weather is pretty similar for the rest of the state.
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Post by trappermac on Apr 26, 2016 18:13:15 GMT -5
Good article in the newest "American Trapper" by Rich Faler on using CR's. He's in PA so the info is relative.
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Post by SawmillCreek on Apr 27, 2016 9:25:08 GMT -5
Just emailed my assemblyman asking for his opinion, see if I get a response. If I do I'll share.
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Post by E.Reynolds on Apr 27, 2016 11:18:46 GMT -5
Adding some contrast, not to long ago every region in the state gained Fisher trapping except for the Adirondacks. The state moved forward happy with what they got...Trappers left behind other trappers for their own gain. I disagree with moving on from this point. I agree with how it was originally written and accepted involving the entire state prior to the underhandedness.
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