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Post by herm on Sept 19, 2015 6:18:01 GMT -5
Yes, have to agree with Von. Reading this thread one would think we trappers are made up from about the same core as the council members. Read these resolutions they are proposing again. See where it says pursue legislation. That means they know they can not get their way by dealing with the DEC, so they want the legislators to do it. With half of the people in or state living in the NYC area do we want to take the authority to manage wildlife away from the DEC and give it to the legislators? Sounds like a political battle to me. Question for you, what orgs. support the NYSCC? What's their interest? AJ, Some orgs. join the Council mainly to try to be a voice of reason to stop the harmful things that could come out of the Council. By joining they have a vote. To me the question is, is it better not to join and give them no money and support, or join them to try and keep them in check.
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Post by peltseeker on Sept 19, 2015 18:48:11 GMT -5
Sorry this thread went way off topic because what i was originally pointing out was the issue of lengthening the coyote season ... which trappers should be against same as the issue of harvesting fisher that aren't prime .... why destroy the animal for nothing is my opinion.. it should only be taken when prime and of value not left to rot in some field in the name of protecting something that it very seldom eats .... yes they do i know but only when the opportunity presents itself .... a healthy adult doe is a pretty good protector of her young and a coyote is often no match for her hooves ... if there is a abundance of deer predator populations go up / deer numbers down predator numbers go down that's how the whole thing works ..... maybe we ought to try not fixing things for awhile and let mother nature do her thing for a change !!!!!! just my two sense
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Post by slyfox74 on Sept 19, 2015 19:18:23 GMT -5
Peltseeker your 2 cents are worth 10 cents in my book. I don't know how many times I've heard one of the Orange Hoard members talk about coyotes predating deer. It's so stupid to hear that. Regarding the QDM/Antler crap. My father kept his antlers for years, scruffy crotch horns, spikes, and huge basket racks, I always asked why he bothered, we were/are meat hunters. Finally this year he decided to get rid of them. They had been stored and spilling out of a big wooden box in his shed. I sold them for him at a yard sale for about $15-$20 each. He made a killing. So maybe these QDM guys are saving them for their retirement?
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Post by peltseeker on Sept 19, 2015 20:06:05 GMT -5
i have a bunch of spikes that would make perfect knife handles for some crafty person !!!!! some are beauties at 11 plus inches
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Post by steven49er on Sept 26, 2015 20:23:27 GMT -5
I'm going ot get in trouble for saying this I suppose but there shouldnt be a season on coyotes anywhere. They are a vermin
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Post by walleyed on Sept 26, 2015 23:48:57 GMT -5
I'm going ot get in trouble for saying this I suppose but there shouldnt be a season on coyotes anywhere. They are a vermin That might fly In Minnesota. or Wisconsin, or someplace Out west but here in the Empire State the Liberal Bunny-kissing, Granola Crunching, Tree Hugging, Vegetarian Bambi Lovers would have a stroke. Also. unacceptable collateral Damage on Denning Fox pups and their Adult parents by Indiscriminate Spray Shooting Varmit Hunters would be the end result of a year round Open season on Coyotes. w
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Post by flatiron on Sept 27, 2015 5:26:40 GMT -5
I'm going ot get in trouble for saying this I suppose but there shouldnt be a season on coyotes anywhere. They are a vermin That might fly In Minnesota. or Wisconsin, or someplace Out west but here in the Empire State the Liberal Bunny-kissing, Granola Crunching, Tree Hugging, Vegetarian Bambi Lovers would have a stroke. Also. unacceptable collateral Damage on Denning Fox pups and their Adult parents by Indiscriminate Spray Shooting Varmit Hunters would be the end result of a year round Open season on Coyotes. w Bob, your talent with the English language always amazes and greatly entertains me ! While subtly proving a point ! I use to hear every year from people I know how many coyotes they shot during Turkey season or Fox and coyotes they shot while woodchuck hunting . I don't hear that much anymore ,Why ? When asking these same sorts what would happen if I told them "I shot 8 deer woodchuck hunting ". Response --- I'd turn yer arise in , my reply " exactly.
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Post by herm on Sept 27, 2015 8:41:19 GMT -5
Dam good reply. I am going to remember that one and use it myself. Then stand back and watch their jaw drop.
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Post by walleyed on Oct 9, 2015 9:07:56 GMT -5
Heard at The Oswego County Trappers Association Meeting on Tuesday that the NYSCC Voted on Their Resolution to Extend The "Coyote Killing Season" through The End of the Spring Turkey Season (end of May), and it Passed.
They (NYCC) will now presumably Lobby the State of New York Bureau of Wildlife to Change the Regulation in The Northern Zone, and Lobby the Legislature to amend the Law in The Southern Zone.
It's is now High Time that the NYSCC is permanently De-funded by the Various Federation of Sportsmen Clubs before they Can do any more damage to the Public Image Of, Or opportunities for, NYS Hunters, Trappers, and Fishermen.
In my Opinion, The NYSCC Leadership is Clearly Inept, and Fails to Represent the Views of It's Constituent Sportsmen Organizations, But rather does What it dang well pleases.
This Latest Development, along with the NYSCC Stance on The Draft fisher Management Plan is proof positive that The NYSCC is No Friend of New York State's Trappers, In My Opinion.
w
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Post by oakhilltrappin on Oct 9, 2015 9:20:53 GMT -5
I'm going ot get in trouble for saying this I suppose but there shouldnt be a season on coyotes anywhere. They are a vermin "Vermin" ?? ....with a price on their pelt worth 3x to 4x of what a coons worth this year, myself I would consider them a Resource !! Which should be managed....My opinion, yoties get a bad rap !!
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Post by walleyed on Oct 9, 2015 9:49:38 GMT -5
"Vermin" ?? ....with a price on their pelt worth 3x to 4x of what a coons worth this year, myself I would consider them a Resource !! Which should be managed....My opinion, yoties get a bad rap !! I agree 100%. We have coyote up here out the Kazoo and on Tug Hill Plateau we get some Deep Snow Winter Deer mortality by Coyotes but they are mostly opportunists here who will eat mice, squirrels, Myriad Small Game,wounded waterfowl, dead or dying roadkill, corn, apples, or other agricultural crops, and whatever else they can scrounge up. Coyote are the Ultimate Omnivore, and Deer make up only a small portion of their Diet during part of the year. They are just one more natural part of the Food web. w
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Post by jdpaint on Oct 9, 2015 18:14:44 GMT -5
I'm going ot get in trouble for saying this I suppose but there shouldnt be a season on coyotes anywhere. They are a vermin "Vermin" ?? ....with a price on their pelt worth 3x to 4x of what a coons worth this year, myself I would consider them a Resource !! Which should be managed....My opinion, yoties get a bad rap !! How much are your coyotes going to average this year ?I think your to high on your valuation.Will the dog runners get to have at them thru May or just hunt/ call ?Hard to get even an opening day price on anything from a buyer.
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Post by hardwoodcharlie on Oct 9, 2015 19:44:30 GMT -5
Might be a pattern in all this ...how many remember what deer season was like years ago back before the old Yote became so popular in the deer woods...I can recall a lot Of hunters back in the day all had the problems or very similar to the ones now have,only wasn't the Yotes getting blamed..back when just about all the small farms were still up and running every piece of state or public ground was swamped with hunters nonresident and locals had to hunt the same woods,because 90% of all the farms had family or friends that hunted the farms leaving the only available land to hunt public lands ..can every one rember what every deer hunter complained about..yep the other hunters in the woods were responsible for just about everybody's shortcomings......how many woman have heard there man try to convince her that buying his hunting gear and supplies was not a waste he assures her he can get it done if he could just have a little woods to himself...... so as years click by farm after farm go out and sell out or lease hunting rights.To help pay land taxes ...so now a huge majority of the public ground hunting gangs have a chance to secure there own hunters paradise after all that's is how it's marketed am I right ? ....so now mr hunter has every thing he ever needed to become the master of the deer woods...just lacking one little thing ...success . So at 9:00am Tuesday morning at just about every diner,gas station,hunting camp, the chatter was all very similar,deer aren't moving,had bad winter not the deer there used to be bla bla bla...then one evening mr hunter was out side and he herd something, something he had never herd before,now all of his questions were answered with a long howl...some called them wild dogs,coy dog,brush wolf,coy wolf,but not any name they came up with really fits ...perhaps they should be named something like the eastern escape goat !!!
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Post by oakhilltrappin on Oct 10, 2015 8:00:20 GMT -5
"Vermin" ?? ....with a price on their pelt worth 3x to 4x of what a coons worth this year, myself I would consider them a Resource !! Which should be managed....My opinion, yoties get a bad rap !! How much are your coyotes going to average this year ?I think your to high on your valuation.Will the dog runners get to have at them thru May or just hunt/ call ?Hard to get even an opening day price on anything from a buyer. ...I don't know, I hear a lot of talk about a dollar or 2 for coon, if you can even get rid of them....Means a coyote only needs to fetch 5 to 10 bucks a piece to hit 4x or 5x....
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Post by trappermac on Oct 10, 2015 8:13:20 GMT -5
" They are just one more natural part of the Food web."
Exactly, but man doesn’t welcome competition does he? The same thought process provokes man to shoot raptors….competes for the small game they feel, when in truth the raptors diet is mainly made up of rodents the size of a red squirrel and smaller. But see a hawk or owl take a bunny just once and then assume that’s their main diet.... is what happens. Find one coyote kill of a deer - that's all they do.
Uneducated public. When I ask folks out here when visiting their country homes or farms if they ever hear coyotes, what I almost always get is..”Oh yeah, we hear them all the time, usually sounds like there are at least 20 coyotes, all howling, I think it’s because they made a kill”. These folks hunt as well, so imagine their thoughts of what they hear. Veteran trappers and woodsman know that what they are hearing is most likely a small family group simply communicating. Imagine if raccoons howled!
The only education many receive is media driven. What they see and listen to is what they believe. What is conceived as entertainment is perceived by them as the truth, the standard. Their perception of the woods, the creatures in it, and the hunt is all learned there. So Bucky on the outdoor show shows you the clothes you should wear, the stand you should use, the bow or gun, the scents, the calls, add naseum…and Joe hunter spends all that money and does it like Bucky but he can’t get that nice buck that Bucky seems to always get, the standard set via media, why? Joe hunter decides he needs a food plot on his land. Hmmm…that didn’t work, let me push for QDM, they talk about that a lot on the Bucky show. That’s going to take a while though, so let’s get rid of the coyotes. Yeah, lets mess with nature, the natural selection of prey and prey animals so that I can justify all this sh@t I bought and get a buck like Buckys! thingy envy.
Unfortunately Wiley coyote is in the way, he has a bad reputation, like the big bad wolf. Most deer hunters feel and believe like Joe hunter. They worship the media deer slayers. They probably also watch reality TV and think it’s reality. They want nothing in their way, not us doe shooting and basket racked killers, not you on their land, and certainly not the coyote. When they finally do take that big buck there will never be that sense of accomplishment a woodsman feels, of blood for blood, death for life. No, it will be dozens of pictures on the smartphone and texting those shots to 20 friends of the great hunter he is.
This is the world we live in. These are the ones making decisions for all of us.
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Post by walleyed on Oct 10, 2015 11:52:32 GMT -5
I don't begrudge the Coyote anything he can get for his Diet, no matter what he can scrounge up.
I will admit that I don't care for Coyotes out-competing the Red fox in the vast majority of Our agricultural landscape in My area, to the point where the Reds are living within the Footprint of Farm Yard Buildings, and on the very edges of towns and villages, where trapping is a bit more challenging due to either the Barn Cats, Or trying to operate under the gaze of towns people and their domestic animals.
But Still, Coyotes subsist on a wide variety of a little bit of everything, and are no more a threat to any game species than the Automobile, Or any number of mortality outcomes so I have a Live and Let Live relationship with The Things.
Meanwhile, It is We Trapper's Job to hammer that point home each and every time we have A Conversation with the Public-At-Large and take the Time to educate the Lack of True Information Outdoor Sportsmen crowd.
Who Else is going to do It ?
Certainly NOT the Inept and Ignorant NYSCC Leadership and Their Ilk ?
w
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Post by mrlongbeard1 on Oct 12, 2015 1:01:43 GMT -5
Those Yotes are good friends to the trappers.Every time they eat a poodle,trapping looks like a better option to the city folk.The rest of the bunk is all about deer hunting. Seems its the only deer hunters count anymore. What happen to time to small game hunt.
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