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Post by ron finewood on Jan 23, 2023 8:32:12 GMT -5
Can a "regular", trapper, with a regular trapping license trap an animal which a bounty is paid on, during the season for that animal, and collect the bounty money. For instance: Farmer Joe raises chickens and the fox are killing his chickens. He gets a nuisance permit to kill fox. Then he decides to offer $20 per fox to who ever kills one. I am a trapper with a regular license. During open fox trapping season, I catch 2 foxes by Joe's chicken coop. He pays me $40. Have I broken the law?
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Post by Dave Morse on Jan 23, 2023 9:48:20 GMT -5
cash never happened. .
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Post by erict on Jan 23, 2023 9:52:53 GMT -5
If you "charge a fee" you would be required to get a NWCO license. If the landowner pays you $XX per target animal, LEGALLY TRAPPED, that is no different than getting paid by a furbuyer who pays for a whole carcass. If the landowner pays you $XX per target animal, trapped UNDER A NUISANCE PERMIT, still no problem, though you should read the permit for restrictions, like whether the animal/pelt must be buried/cremated (common for out of season trapping). If it were me, nothing would be in writing and I'd rather accept a "CASH TIP" or FREE EGGS from the landowner for agreeing to dispose of animal carcasses ("wink, wink"), NOT for trapping. PS - instead of "bounty", I'd use the term "reward".
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Post by ron finewood on Jan 23, 2023 16:53:50 GMT -5
I called Region 8, DEC in Avon today and asked the same question. I was told that if during the appropriate season for the animal, and the animal is a protected furbearer, and I am a regular licensed trapper, that a private person OR a business, that has secured a nuisance permit, can pay to have an animal removed and the trapper can legally accept the money. If out of season---different story. Then I would have to have a nuisance wildlife control license. Also, if it is a municipality that has the nuisance permit and offers a bounty then I would have to have the NWCL. This seems to be a tricky question, as I have been told different answers by different ECO's.
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Post by trappermac on Jan 23, 2023 20:41:35 GMT -5
Well I think what Eric posted is accurate, mirrors what DEC told you. Just make sure it's a furbearer and the trapping season for that furbearer is open.
I'm a NWCO with a business but in the scenario you describe with the fox problem I would just be looking for permission to trap his property during the canine season, no charge to the landowner.
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Post by erict on Jan 23, 2023 20:58:57 GMT -5
I don't agree with what they told you and would be interested in hearing if you spoke to Wildlife or Law Enforcement. If the season is open and you have a trapping license that's all you need and can ACCEPT money. If you CHARGE, you require an NWCO license. The nuisance permit is irrelevant. Regardless, if the season is open or closed, you DO NOT need a trapping license nor do you need a NWCO license as long as you are named on the nuisance permit. If you don't believe me, read THIS, paragraph 1 specifically. (Paragraph 2 applies to nuisance beaver). Permits will usually have "standard conditions" that apply to all permits, then "special conditions" if needed. If going the permit route, it never hurts to ASK for allowances that make sense (how much sense does it make to waste a nuisance beaver with a good pelt, or to throw out the meat, or castor?). They can say "yes" or "no". Landowners do not need a license or permit to take certain nuisance animals. Specific to fox, read THIS, paragraph 6. In general, the state and municipalities are prohibited from offering bounties for the taking of wildlife. Read THIS. If a municipality offers a bounty for health reasons (rabies, for example), they must pay for it out of county monies - they can't get reimbursed by the state. Good luck.
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Post by trappermac on Jan 24, 2023 9:11:39 GMT -5
The hangup is CHARGE vs ACCEPT...I agree with you Eric that if you are asked to act as the agent to a permit holder then you would need a NWCO license to charge, however no license required if you only "accept" money. A NWCO license permits you to "charge" for services.
And yes, anyone can be named the agent to a permit holder, but that carcass or live animal cannot leave the property for which the permit was issued without a NWCO license unless the season is open for that animal.
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Post by ron finewood on Jan 24, 2023 16:09:52 GMT -5
Good talk!!
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brooklynbeaver
Making my spirit ready for new trapping season
Posts: 63
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Post by brooklynbeaver on Jan 30, 2023 11:12:11 GMT -5
A very material educational responses. Thank you.
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Post by minker97 on Feb 2, 2023 14:36:19 GMT -5
If you are getting paid whether your charging for the service or there giving it as a “present” it changes everything you now are required to pass the ny wildlife control exam, keep weekly logs & send them in every September & last I knew you were required to have general liability insurance. Now this is considered a business & you are a lot more liable than a fur trapper while having to collect sales tax & hold all the required business licenses. As a full time wildlife control operator the best advice i can give you is get your nuisance license & don’t charge or do nuisance work full time
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brooklynbeaver
Making my spirit ready for new trapping season
Posts: 63
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Post by brooklynbeaver on Feb 2, 2023 15:28:42 GMT -5
I found your explanation as a very solid and logically supported one. Indeed, your hobby could become a business and if such transformation happened tons of headaches be prepared to carry on. I've faced recently with a barrier between us meeting a remote community board whose members really suffer from beaver committed damage to a lake close properties. They cannot hire just a trapper , they require a full package of documents.
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Post by ron finewood on Feb 5, 2023 9:18:20 GMT -5
Where is Judge Judy when you need her??
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Post by erict on Sept 4, 2023 19:55:54 GMT -5
If you are getting paid whether your charging for the service or there giving it as a “present” it changes everything you now are required to pass the ny wildlife control exam, keep weekly logs & send them in every September & last I knew you were required to have general liability insurance. Now this is considered a business & you are a lot more liable than a fur trapper while having to collect sales tax & hold all the required business licenses. As a full time wildlife control operator the best advice i can give you is get your nuisance license & don’t charge or do nuisance work full time I understand NWCOs want to protect business but I disagree. Where in the ECL or rules and regulations is this prohibited? It isn't. In this case, there is no recourse by either party - if the "bounty" isn't paid, the trapper can't go to small claims court - if the trapper doesn't catch any critters - the bounty-payers can't hold him responsible for additional damage. Let's face it - this hypothetical is very uncommon. The smartest thing to do is for everyone to agree that it's not a "bounty" because that's fodder for the "antis". Farmer Jones with the fox problem is better off simply offering fresh apple pies or gas money, though there is still no problem with a straight out cash payment per critter legally trapped.
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brooklynbeaver
Making my spirit ready for new trapping season
Posts: 63
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Post by brooklynbeaver on Sept 5, 2023 7:30:00 GMT -5
Don't you see my dear fellows trappers our government likes to play games everywhere with everyone as long as US dollars involved. Government want to collect its own reward in form of taxes from anything. In a case scenario when it seems hard or close to impossible to collect any "business" activity will be prohibited. Have no idea why such "by definition" rule still employed : if US government cannot cut their share from your dollar amount proceeding such activity will be forbidden. I can see that like this. Otherwise, such "stupid" situation has no since. Regular people like us trappers have to invent something alternative to substitute a "reward" or a "fee" word to remain our hobby's activity in legal brackets. When you order an exterminator's job to kill roaches or carpet ants inside your dwelling, to trap rats or mice in your barn you are not facing any problems. Why ? Because an exterminator pays taxes from the dollar amount he/she put on an invoice. A private trapper cannot produce an invoice, therefore his/her cash reward is not taxable income. I see only such point of distraction that prevents us regular trappers to be paid for trapping nuisance animals.
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Post by bobsamuelson on Sept 11, 2023 9:48:14 GMT -5
You guys are reading too much into the regulation! It’s actually pretty simple!
If you have a regular trapping license you can trap those animals that have a season.
If someone has an issue with a nuisance animal, you can trap it for the landowner but you cannot charge a fee. The landowner can give you a dozen ears of corn or permission to trap his property during the respective open seasons.
Much of the whether one can charge or not was foisted upon NYS and the DEC by Animal Rights groups! NYS complied with the current NWCO licensing in response to the threats of law suits.
Something to keep in mind: there are people who do NWCO work as a livelihood, just like a plumber or a lawyer in their respective professions. Those who only charge $25 to remove a skunk are not only hurting those trying to make a living, but are also disrespecting yourself and your skill level! To fix that, take the NWCO test and get licensed!
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