|
Post by peltseeker on Nov 14, 2015 8:40:20 GMT -5
My son told me today that someone trapping in averill park area in rensselear county caught a mountain lion/cougar ... DEC continues to deny that they exist in NY...but these sightings continue every year in this area and the adirondacks and one caught in a trap and photographed would be proof they couldnt deny. Has anyone heard the rumor or seen the pictures
|
|
|
Post by rusty on Nov 14, 2015 9:36:32 GMT -5
Old lady at work says she has two of them frequently at her farm . I doubt it but she gets mad as hell when you call her a crazy lady. I'll believe a lion here in N.Y. when I catch one or see one in the back of a truck.
|
|
|
Post by trappermac on Nov 14, 2015 14:42:23 GMT -5
Always plenty of rumors....just that, rumors. Photoshop is fun stuff.
|
|
|
Post by countryboynwco on Nov 14, 2015 16:37:20 GMT -5
Mac my thoughts exactly ! Until my eyes see it I won't believe it ! A friend claimed to have a pic of one from Windham but as soon as I saw it, it was clearly a large bobcat. He argued until I pulled out my camera and said so then there are all mtn lions I caught the past 2 yrs he was clearly mistaken but other people could not be convinced! The situation actually frustrated me because I knew what it was and when I said it people got irate over it.
|
|
|
Post by alpom on Nov 16, 2015 9:47:48 GMT -5
Never saw footprint in snow. Are they flying?
|
|
|
Post by mrlongbeard1 on Nov 17, 2015 1:58:36 GMT -5
my answer to that question is. With all the thousands of deer cameras out there. Where are all the pictures. Think about it..
|
|
|
Post by Lonny Mattison on Nov 17, 2015 6:54:57 GMT -5
Well Von has been known to harbor Sasquatch and Buckbuster caught it!
|
|
|
Post by mole on Nov 17, 2015 16:33:30 GMT -5
Any animal that one might consider rare , I would not be broadcasting it over the air ways. What if someone all of a sudden gets their foot in the door and says rare animal,, Protect the Rare animal.. NY State do your part to protect the Rare Animal.. No Hunting, No Trapping Save the Rare Animal
|
|
|
Post by peltseeker on Nov 17, 2015 16:50:22 GMT -5
Actually there was trail camera pictures taken of a mountain lion in the catskills and DEC said that the location couldnt be verified from the pictures so again they did not confirm.. They are known to be in vermont and of course Canada to the north so if your that nieve to believe that there couldnt be a small population in new york.... Ask the people in johnsonville new york what tore the neck out of their horse and killed it... Im sure they will give you their opinion as to what it was but again DEC wouldnt confirm but in that incident they wouldnt deny either... Oh and lets not forget the confirmed kill in Massachusetts where a mountain lion was hit by a car ... Guess that was a immaculate connection...
|
|
austinp
#3 Newhouse
the next fur season is never far from our minds :)
Posts: 3,008
|
Post by austinp on Nov 17, 2015 17:35:55 GMT -5
The title of this thread is incorrect.. one needn't ever dispel rumor... a rumor needs to be proven as fact. It is known facts that need be dispelled. You have the burden of proof in backwards order here
As for breeding populations of mountain lions in NY? There are zero, nada, none. There could be infrequent stragglers that migrate in, pass thru or get released from illegal captivity. But that's all.
As for me, I'm still waiting for the very first set of confirmed tracks in snow, anywhere here in NY. When I lived in Colorado, you could cut a set of cat tracks in the snow about any day you tried out there where breeding populations truly exist. Why no tracks in the snow anywhere here in New York during winter?
|
|
|
Post by mikeb on Nov 17, 2015 20:00:57 GMT -5
I agree with you Austin-we have heard starnge things at night down at our camp in Dansville???Possibly bobcat?Same as you have stated -although twice we cut a set of really large tracks in the woods-never took pictures as this was awhile ago-but never have gotten any trail cam pics either.
|
|
|
Post by squash on Nov 17, 2015 20:05:12 GMT -5
Well stated Austin. As far as the MA Mtn lion hit by an auto, it was confirmed to have genetics from mt lions fromSouth Dakota . mt lions were fairly common in NY in the early 1800's, Nat Foster and Nick Stoner killed many in the ADK's. According to the NY fish &Game Commision report for 1902 & 03, the last bounty paid for a MT lion in NY was in the late 1800's. My copy of this report is at my camp, as soon as I get back to camp I'll post the exact date and price paid.
As far as a modern breeding population in NY, no crediable evidence has been produced. As a side note, northern zone deer sighting reports this season are very low, apparently last winter was much harder on the deer herds than expected, mt lions are the last thing we need in NY.
|
|
|
Post by slyfox74 on Nov 17, 2015 20:20:47 GMT -5
A few less deer in this state wouldn't be all that bad. Maybe the DEC would cut down few weeks on the deer season. The northeast zone allows the antler collectors 78 days to kill their share of Venison jerky, shoot coyotes and fishers and leave them in the woods to rot, and demand exclusive use to "their woods". Finally after December 13th, when Fisher season is over, I'm allowed to plow through knee deep snow and try to catch some K-9's, the ones that didn't get shot and left to rot in the woods.
|
|
|
Post by yoters on Nov 17, 2015 20:26:12 GMT -5
Peltseeker, the guy from the Catskills is a local. He put pictures on Facebook then all of a sudden they were down. He claimed it was local and the dec wanted him to take them down. Not sure what the real story is though. I believe in what Austin said, it just makes sense.
|
|
tmc
#2 Newhouse
Posts: 2,447
|
Post by tmc on Nov 17, 2015 23:51:07 GMT -5
Why no tracks in the snow anywhere here in New York during winter? Wow, what a rube!!! SHEEESH!!! EVERYONE knows they ride on backs of bigfoots and cross the roads with chickens. Ain't you never learnt nuffin', Austin??
|
|
austinp
#3 Newhouse
the next fur season is never far from our minds :)
Posts: 3,008
|
Post by austinp on Nov 18, 2015 5:09:10 GMT -5
tmc... true story. I had a rather spirited debate with a lady some years ago who swore her sister's neighbor's farmer neighbor had a litter of cougars they watched frolicking together in a hayfield all summer. I told her cougars had somewhat large home ranges and even a female with kittens will cover a lot of ground. She refused to listen. I asked her where all the pictures of this event are, she replied the DEC came and took them all away. Must be they searched the whole house to confiscate everything.
Then I asked her why nobody ever saw tracks in the snow all winter... her reply? Why she looked at me like I was five years old and in a most condescending tone of voice said, "everyone knows they sleep in caves all winter"
What more was there for me to say after that?
|
|
|
Post by trappermac on Nov 18, 2015 5:47:16 GMT -5
Imagine if bobcats had long tails......the cougar sightings we'd have.
|
|
|
Post by squash on Nov 18, 2015 7:39:18 GMT -5
A few less deer in this state wouldn't be all that bad. Maybe the DEC would cut down few weeks on the deer season. The northeast zone allows the antler collectors 78 days to kill their share of Venison jerky, shoot coyotes and fishers and leave them in the woods to rot, and demand exclusive use to "their woods". Finally after December 13th, when Fisher season is over, I'm allowed to plow through knee deep snow and try to catch some K-9's, the ones that didn't get shot and left to rot in the woods. I know where and hunt the Northern Zone, but don't know where the Northeast zone is ? If these hunters are ,"antler collectors, "why are they making jerky ? Some of These so called ,"antler collectors", may demand exclusive use, but they don't have it ? The company I work for leases 30,000 acres to 15 hunt clubs, few if any of these lessees trap, so we give trappers complete access to the 30,000 acres to any trapper who asks to trap. " A few less deer," that tells me you don't hunt WMU 6N, my hunting observations and all hunting reports I've heard this fall in many parts of the northern zone, is there are few deer. Looks that last winter kill was greater than thought ? Our biggest hunt club (7000 acres) historically harvested 20 - 40 bucks per year. As far as I know to date they've killed 1 buck so far this season. I agree, shooting and leaving furbearers to rot is wanton waste, and anyone who shoots a fisher with a deer rifle is a fool. As for coyotes, they are a invasive species and not indigenous to NY, so I don't have a problem with deer hunters shooting them. Finally, deer hunters don't have a monopoly on slobs, unfortunately, there are a few in the ranks of trappers as well.
|
|
|
Post by ron finewood on Nov 18, 2015 16:48:08 GMT -5
Squash----I have a camp in the North Woods and would love to know where your leased property is. IS there a way to get a location and contact name/number for the hunt club authorities?
Ron
|
|
|
Post by squash on Nov 18, 2015 17:11:57 GMT -5
Ron, Sent you a PM Squash
|
|
|
Post by proratman on Nov 19, 2015 15:54:20 GMT -5
Considering what is going on in Maine and Idaho with the lynx. NO ONE! saw or caught a mountain lion in New York. Period.
|
|
|
Post by slyfox74 on Nov 20, 2015 5:38:28 GMT -5
A few less deer in this state wouldn't be all that bad. Maybe the DEC would cut down few weeks on the deer season. The northeast zone allows the antler collectors 78 days to kill their share of Venison jerky, shoot coyotes and fishers and leave them in the woods to rot, and demand exclusive use to "their woods". Finally after December 13th, when Fisher season is over, I'm allowed to plow through knee deep snow and try to catch some K-9's, the ones that didn't get shot and left to rot in the woods. I know where and hunt the Northern Zone, but don't know where the Northeast zone is ? If these hunters are ,"antler collectors, "why are they making jerky ? Some of These so called ,"antler collectors", may demand exclusive use, but they don't have it ? The company I work for leases 30,000 acres to 15 hunt clubs, few if any of these lessees trap, so we give trappers complete access to the 30,000 acres to any trapper who asks to trap. " A few less deer," that tells me you don't hunt WMU 6N, my hunting observations and all hunting reports I've heard this fall in many parts of the northern zone, is there are few deer. Looks that last winter kill was greater than thought ? Our biggest hunt club (7000 acres) historically harvested 20 - 40 bucks per year. As far as I know to date they've killed 1 buck so far this season. I agree, shooting and leaving furbearers to rot is wanton waste, and anyone who shoots a fisher with a deer rifle is a fool. As for coyotes, they are a invasive species and not indigenous to NY, so I don't have a problem with deer hunters shooting them. Finally, deer hunters don't have a monopoly on slobs, unfortunately, there are a few in the ranks of trappers as well. I apologize squash, I made a horrible mistake and said "Northeast zone" when in fact it is, the Northern Zone. As far as deer populations where you are. You're correct, I don't hunt deer there. Here in 6G I have no trouble filling my tag. I shoot the first buck I see every year, and a doe, I try to pick an old doe, but I don't like to waste a ton of time being picky. I remember as a young boy my father and his hunting partner going almost the whole season without even seeing a buck to shoot. I remember each of them being more than happy with a scruffy little crotch horn just to have some meat in the freezer. It was a different game back then. People hunted deer to lessen the grocery bill. The reason I made the jerky reference is because I've heard of people making an entire deer into jerky. See they don't really like venison as much as they like the antlers or the head mount to brag up. The meat is secondary and it often gets reduced to a Super Bowl snack. just last week I had a landowner tell me how many coyotes he's shot because they're killing all the deer. He claimed that the deer herd has suffered badly due to predation and winter die off. The same guy passed up on 2 bucks before he killed one with a rack big enough to talk about. I wondered to myself when the last time he went a whole season without filling his tag. How many deer are enough? In my experience, deer hunters aren't happy unless there are roving herds of deer reminiscent of the Great Plains Bison herds in the early 1800's. And how many of the precious deer do the invasive coyotes kill? Honestly. We've erased the wolves from out natural order, as well as mountain lions. What makes a deer more worthy of survival that a wolf, mountain lion or coyote? And regarding their "invasive species status" Coyotes made their way here on their own, possibly because they can't read road signs. I don't know but that hardly makes them invasive. They are indigenous to North America, moreover, they are protected by the laws of our state, not to mention a valuable natural resource. Not a foreign invasive scourge that should be killed for no reason other than they are misunderstood by some orange hoard weekend warriors.
|
|
|
Post by newfox1 on Nov 20, 2015 18:21:36 GMT -5
deer hunting will bring out the WORSE in people!!!!!!
|
|
|
Post by squash on Nov 20, 2015 19:28:59 GMT -5
I know where and hunt the Northern Zone, but don't know where the Northeast zone is ? If these hunters are ,"antler collectors, "why are they making jerky ? Some of These so called ,"antler collectors", may demand exclusive use, but they don't have it ? The company I work for leases 30,000 acres to 15 hunt clubs, few if any of these lessees trap, so we give trappers complete access to the 30,000 acres to any trapper who asks to trap. " A few less deer," that tells me you don't hunt WMU 6N, my hunting observations and all hunting reports I've heard this fall in many parts of the northern zone, is there are few deer. Looks that last winter kill was greater than thought ? Our biggest hunt club (7000 acres) historically harvested 20 - 40 bucks per year. As far as I know to date they've killed 1 buck so far this season. I agree, shooting and leaving furbearers to rot is wanton waste, and anyone who shoots a fisher with a deer rifle is a fool. As for coyotes, they are a invasive species and not indigenous to NY, so I don't have a problem with deer hunters shooting them. Finally, deer hunters don't have a monopoly on slobs, unfortunately, there are a few in the ranks of trappers as well. I apologize squash, I made a horrible mistake and said "Northeast zone" when in fact it is, the Northern Zone. As far as deer populations where you are. You're correct, I don't hunt deer there. Here in 6G I have no trouble filling my tag. I shoot the first buck I see every year, and a doe, I try to pick an old doe, but I don't like to waste a ton of time being picky. I remember as a young boy my father and his hunting partner going almost the whole season without even seeing a buck to shoot. I remember each of them being more than happy with a scruffy little crotch horn just to have some meat in the freezer. It was a different game back then. People hunted deer to lessen the grocery bill. The reason I made the jerky reference is because I've heard of people making an entire deer into jerky. See they don't really like venison as much as they like the antlers or the head mount to brag up. The meat is secondary and it often gets reduced to a Super Bowl snack. just last week I had a landowner tell me how many coyotes he's shot because they're killing all the deer. He claimed that the deer herd has suffered badly due to predation and winter die off. The same guy passed up on 2 bucks before he killed one with a rack big enough to talk about. I wondered to myself when the last time he went a whole season without filling his tag. How many deer are enough? In my experience, deer hunters aren't happy unless there are roving herds of deer reminiscent of the Great Plains Bison herds in the early 1800's. And how many of the precious deer do the invasive coyotes kill? Honestly. We've erased the wolves from out natural order, as well as mountain lions. What makes a deer more worthy of survival that a wolf, mountain lion or coyote? And regarding their "invasive species status" Coyotes made their way here on their own, possibly because they can't read road signs. I don't know but that hardly makes them invasive. They are indigenous to North America, moreover, they are protected by the laws of our state, not to mention a valuable natural resource. Not a foreign invasive scourge that should be killed for no reason other than they are misunderstood by some orange hoard weekend warriors. Sly, I agree that many deer hunters kill deer but really don't want the meat, and that bugs me as well. You seem to be an advocate for having coyotes in the Northeast US ? As for the coyotes, no one east of the Mississippi knew what they were until the Lewis and Clark expedition. Making it here on their own is debatable, and in the last 200-300years, I know of no other animal (except maybe the whitetail) that is/was indigenous to North America ,that has invaded parts of the country where they never lived historically before ? What about the red fox that they have displaced ? My area I used to catch 5-10 reds each fall, I haven't caught a red in the last 5 years, there are few if any here anymore. Just like the wolves are eradicating the coyote in Yellowstone. Atleast on coyotes we can agree to dis agree, I say kill them all, use the pelt or not. It could only help the deer population and most definitely would help small game populations. And for Mtn Lions in NY, if there are any really here ? SSS. Wolves and Mtn Lions in NY would mean the end to the leg hold trap .
|
|
|
Post by slyfox74 on Nov 20, 2015 20:16:25 GMT -5
I agree that they have hurt the Red Fox population. That bothers me, I like catching the Red Fox, even though Red Foxes are not indigenous to North America. They were brought over from England. All hail Ricky Bobby!
|
|