Buckbuster you missed one very valuable point. When we asked them too they also got on the phone and e-mailed etc. to support cable restraint bill(hudson valley sportman site). Its a trapper friendly site. I understand the implications of legislation vs. regulation very well and agree its dangerous. Ive said it a ton of times......politics have no place in wildlife management.
I predict that in the areas of AR's there will soon be large areas of leased land and the guys who succeeded in throwing us under the bus will become "guides" who will advertise their area as the Illinois of the East. A lot of the regular folk who jumped on this will be frozen out of areas or be forced to hire a "guide" and pay a fee for the outfitting. If this happens I think scientific management will be gone.
Studies have been done on whitetails as well as mule deer and it has been found that AR"s do not work they actually have a negative impact on the heard. I love to bow hunt and used to take three weeks vacation to do it. I now find myself not caring as much for the sport as it is being more commercialized. If you guys want bigger buck you do not need AR's. The mid western states that put a large number of deer in the record books do not use them. They have SHORT gun seasons which allow the deer to get age on them, end of story. Do not get me wrong I try to kill a mature deer here every year and go without shooting a buck for years in a row. I simply like the challenge as well as the time I spend sitting in a tree stand. I DO NOT however look down upon or critize anyone for shooting a 1 1/2 yearold buck. Shoot what makes you happy cause that is why you are out there doing it. We all pay the same amount for our tags and should be able to shoot what we feel makes our season a success. The DEC is worried that not enough deer will be killed with a shortened gun season and the gun hunters do like the fact that bow hunters get so much time to hunt. The problem with gun season being three weeks long is guy procrastinate and if it is to windy or rainy or snowy they say oh I will go out tomorrow. That does not happen. If you implemented a one week deer saeson guys would hunt rain or shine and the deer would get killed. You in return for a shorter season would get larger bucks and more of them. Oh and a happy Zagger lol. These are just my humble opinions and are not meant to offend anyone. Some on this site that are older than I remember when the gun season was only a week long and am sure they hunted the whole week if they still had tags to fill. Keep the government out of the outdoors!!!!
You are right, I should be satisfied with the freedoms which are still allotted me and I should understand that freedoms believed to have been lost in my lifetime and previous to my existence and those perceived about to be lost are not real, necessary or deserved, for there are many in our world much more oppressed than I. Freedom is relative. My miss understanding of the Constitution and the individuality granted there in should have taken into account those oppressions and the will and want of everyone and anyone wanting me comparable to them. I am sorry. My lack of education and poor communication skills only allowed me to convey that of which you took from my post. I was attempting to state something much more significant. I was miss guided but will comply, for I am but a lowly trapper.
The 3rd Saturday in October seems like a simple thing...agreed.
On the AR bill, I did a little looking around and the best explanation I could find for what happened is at this website.. outdoornews.com/new_york/news/article_1c42e4fa-8d16-11e0-a115-001cc4c002e0.html ....which is from the Outdoor News website. Apparently a group called the New York State Whitetail Management Coalition was behind the legislative push for the bill. David Hartman heads it up and the most alarming quote from that article is :
"Our first choice would be to have DEC put ARs in place," Hartman said. "But DEC told us to go this route."
...meaning they were steered towards the legislative process by the DEC? What???
That's a interesting post Mac. Makes a person wonder if there is a battle in the DEC. Like I originally said, when the DEC went to having conservation officers vs. Game Wardens, their priorities changed. All IMO again.
To Brushwolf you are right in the aspect that a few and i mean just a few did support the cable restraints but man o man were they hot on the AR bill if ya said some thing that was negative towards the bill they cut your head off and hung it from there meat pole . Does any one have a clue as to why these bills are being pushed like this in the legislature? Bills like this are being PUSHED in this state by QDM groups real hard. How many of you guys know of someone that has gone out out of state to hunt trophy whitetails and have come back skunked and about 4000.00 dollars poorer every one wants to have bucks like Illonois or Iowa in thier back yards the new modern deer hunter is all about horns. The deer hunters of this state have a lot of power and when enough of them make noise they are heard and will get what ever they want, this bill is the by product of a lot of noise by TAX PAYING deer hunters.
Last Edit: Aug 21, 2011 20:04:29 GMT -5 by Deleted
Jonh thanks for standing up..When someone throws you a lemon you make lemon aid. Man you guys don't sound like trappers to me. Whiners!!!! So someone will have to take care of these properties to control the coyote's. That would be us. This is an opportunity. You guys should talk to Clint a little more. Next time stay on top of things..Buck we all pay tax. Just some of us make more noise than the others. WAKE UP TRAPPERS AND MAKE SOME NOISE.
Post by trapswithkids on Aug 23, 2011 4:34:53 GMT -5
As far who did this, it was done by "fellow sportsmen". When you look at the bill, you'll see it was sponsored by State Senator Bonacic at the request of the Ulster and Sullivan "sportsmen's" federations.
Post by johnrockwood on Aug 23, 2011 8:05:31 GMT -5
and those folks had plenty of coaching and advice from Dave Miller and others as to why that approach in the Legislature was absolutely the WRONG way to go about it ! Dave, myself and Bill Smith had a lot of contact with these folks so they knew that this was not a good thing for sportsmen. They did not care at all as long as they got what they wanted, any way they could get it. Divide and conquer ?
Post by trapswithkids on Aug 23, 2011 11:53:52 GMT -5
Their names and deeds should be published then. If someone from "our" community commits an act so damaging to our interests that we now risk losing the sport altogether, their name and deeds should be widely published so we all know who to ignore in the future. They should also be removed from whatever "leadership" position they hold that allowed them to do this to the rest of us.
Antler restrictions are a return to European system of hunting and game management. Page 118 of Russ Carman's "The Illusions of Animal Rights" covers it perfectly. Under the European system where only the very rich, or people of royal blood, are able to follow the sport of hunting. The kings retained the ownership of the game animals. Carman states, " It is interesting that a number of people who formulated the animal rights philosophy were raised under the European system and as their philosophy indicates, still adhere to the idea that only the elite of society should decide the fate of animals". Don't shoot the king's deer. They think that the common man is not smart enough or worthy enough to harvest the king's deer.
Last Edit: Aug 24, 2011 20:14:46 GMT -5 by ponyboy
Hayzer912: Anybody selling any skulls? Looking for Red/Gray Fox, Coon, Coyote Thanks!
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fastmari: DOES IT HAV TO HAV BOTTOM JAW ATTACHED? I hav a local Grey skull; young, possibly female. Totally clean,& a lot of th Skeleton/legs, et But I always extract teeth4 myself. OK, so can u tell me what you require in Fox skull when you ask4 "skull" thnx
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brooklynbeaver: Paw holding beaver trap modification. Have to talk and listen those experienced trappers if I did it right. My last season experience pushed me to make such modification.
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Olde Trapper: no response available...
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