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Post by johnrockwood on Aug 18, 2011 17:00:08 GMT -5
The Governor has signed the antler restriction bill. This sets a very dangerous precedent that could allow the legislature to have far greater authority over managing NYS wildlife and the regulatory process. We have no policy on antler restriction but it should not have been, and need not have been legislated.
Bottom line------ those who promoted this in the legislature threw every sportsman and woman in NYS under the bus.
David Miller
Executive Director
New York State Trappers Association
Phone: (607) 522-4707
Cell: (607) 664-7161
Fax: (607) 522-3033
Email guarddn@empacc.net
I would like to make note to you folks that Dave used some of the strongest negative language I've ever heard him use about the passage of this bill. This sets and extremely dangerous precident that we have tried to stop from happening for many years. The management of our wildlife belongs in the hands of the biologists at the NYSDEC, not in the hands of our Legislature. I would ask that you not go too far with your discussions on here in regard to this as we never know who may be reading this. I will tell you that Dave said, and I agree, that if any of you trappers know anyone who pushed in favor of this bill, they should have their asses kicked for setting this dangerous precident of hugely negative proportions. This is a perfect example of selfish special interest group(S) effectively lobbying for something that could do nothing but hurt fellow sportsmen and women. Not that the antler restrictions make one bit of difference, but that it was done in the Legislature does ! I will add that NYSTA takes no position on antler restrictions but feels that the decisions regarding that should have been left up to the professional wildlife managers at the NYSDEC. If they had felt antler restrictions were appropriate anywhere in the state, then it should have been done by regulation by the DEC. Please remember that we have been trying to legalize the use of cable restraints, which are illegal through Legislation, for about 20 years.
John Rockwood, President New York State Trappers Assoc. Phone: 315-415-4946 Email: Loggerjohnr@aol.com
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Post by charlielambjr on Aug 18, 2011 17:09:10 GMT -5
people forget you cant eat bone
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Post by furman1989 on Aug 18, 2011 17:27:03 GMT -5
People with big bank accounts get what they want. again.
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Post by barrington on Aug 18, 2011 17:35:51 GMT -5
I like my deer for the table not the wall. Big horns bring big idiots that will stop at nothing to kill the big boy. Crops grow big deer not selective harvest. If you had a question about wildlife would you ask a legislature?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 18, 2011 20:41:00 GMT -5
John i know a bunch of people from the hudson valley sportsmen wedsite down here that couldn't get on the phone fast enough to there legislators they were all in favor of this legislation, at times it is a very piss poor site with lot of misguided information that members share with each other . i have been complain slapped many times for expressing concerns about sportsmen conduct on that site that i won't post on there unless it pertains to some thing positive.
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Post by papabear on Aug 18, 2011 21:26:48 GMT -5
Dear Friends, It appears that the (un) "Educated Idiots" prevail once again. Could someone PLEASE tell me whatever happened to good ole COMMON SENSE. Regards papabear
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Post by sthet on Aug 18, 2011 21:31:07 GMT -5
This is unConstitutional and needs to addressed as such.
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Post by johnrockwood on Aug 18, 2011 22:23:30 GMT -5
Joel, do as Dave suggested - kick their dumb asses !
papabear - must be you didn't see the obituaries a few years ago, common sense died !
The problem with this whole issue is not so much that of the antler restrictions itself, but of the fact that these fools that pushed for this legislation have now given the power of wildlife management, in this instance, to the Legislature. Does that mean our lawmakers know more about wildlife biology and management than our biologists at the DEC ? I don't think so. I view it as a slap in the face to our NYSDEC and to all other sportsmen and women in this state.
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Post by slyfox74 on Aug 18, 2011 22:37:36 GMT -5
Our government, both state and federal needs to be shut down, and rebuilt from scratch. The good old USA doesn't exist anymore. We've morphed into some sort of Orwellian, pseudo-democracy where there is an unspoken heirarchy of power. The vocal minority now runs our lives.
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Post by spur on Aug 19, 2011 5:42:08 GMT -5
my brother and i beleive we should re-elect no one if they are in office we should replace them !!!
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Post by trappermac on Aug 19, 2011 7:00:25 GMT -5
So it's wildlife management by legislation instead of regulation by the DEC.....how much more can this state embarrass itself? I suppose we now know our Governors' position on the DEC.
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Post by johnrockwood on Aug 19, 2011 8:08:48 GMT -5
Sure does make you wonder how the conversation went when the DEC Commissioner tried to convince the Governor NOT to sign that bill doesn't it ?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2011 8:46:10 GMT -5
We lost this battle even with the DEC years ago when we went from having "Game Wardens" to enviromental conservation officers. All of course, IMO
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Zagman
#2 Newhouse
Posts: 2,186
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Post by Zagman on Aug 19, 2011 9:27:18 GMT -5
The whitetail rules the world! Longer and longer gun seasons. Crossbows. Longer bow season coming. Extended muzzleloader season. Antler restrictions (meaning a guy needs to be in the woods longer to tag out vs. shooting the first buck he sees) Farms being leased up in droves. All of this adding up and eroding the quality of our trapping experience and basically elimating any chance to trap unencumbered by a deer hunter or hunters. Again.....deer gun season USED to start the Monday AFTER Thanksgiving....then, it went to the Saturday after Thanksgiving. Then, it went to the Monday before Thanksgiving......now, its the Saturday before Thanksgiving. But, alas, while I find this trend alarming, my pointing it out over the last couple years on this site has basically fallen on deaf ears. I have accepted that due to the deafening silence from my peers, I am in the minority, and therefore, have basically agreeed to keep my big trap shut! LOL Late season and cables will be the only way for us to enjoy our passion.......though, ironically, my sense is the deer hunters will NOT be across-the-board in favor of cable restraint utilization (based largely on NOT being educated as to their use and benefit). Our hard start date (October 25th) looses us yet another day of trapping before deer gun.......22 days, 21 days, 20 days last year, 19 this year......guess what? 18 days next year...... If season opened the 22nd (Saturday) we'd be back to the 22 days. But, we'd have all that unprime fur! That extra time means a lot to me, but apparently, to the masses, not a big deal. The more I type, the more I realize I am NOT keeping my big trap shut! I was against the open season on coyotes.....but in the end, the coyote viewed as vermin may be the leverage we need to get cables, which will finally let us "trap" after the New Year when foot trap utilization is dicey. Granted, we'll all have to get snowmobiles, trailers, etc to get around to deploy our tools...... but that's another subject! Carry on! MZ
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Post by Itrapny on Aug 19, 2011 11:42:21 GMT -5
Mark...you're not alone...I'm all for opening the trapping season on the Saturday before the 25th of October. Always have been, always will be and it has nothing to do with the primeness of fur in the DEC's eyes as far as I can tell. Their ultimate concern is wildlife mangement 1st and fur primeness is a secondary consideration based upon our current seasons. If fur quality was a big consideration, the fisher season wouldn't open until later in the year and we'd have a Spring muskrat & beaver thoroughout NY.
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Post by milkie62 on Aug 19, 2011 12:06:06 GMT -5
Similar to the crap in Mass. No footholds or conibears and when the beaver flooded everything tree huggers wanted help.Their DEC said we had a plan in place for 200 yrs.It was called "TRAPPING". Permits should not have been issued over there,just let the beaver flood the state until they brought it back.
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Zagman
#2 Newhouse
Posts: 2,186
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Post by Zagman on Aug 19, 2011 13:25:21 GMT -5
Wayne...my reference to "unprime fur" was not directed at the DEC, but rather, the numerous vocal opponents of the idea on here......
I said it before.....if you dont agree on an earlier opener for us, do it for the kids!!!!
We all talk about getting the next generation involved.....most of the hunting seasons start on Saturdays. Yet the trapping seasons do not......
A few have said this was a battle hashed out years ago (setting the hard date of Oct 25th) allowing people to plan next year's vacation.
No one has ever explained to me the why a guy cannot plan next year's vacation now for a trapping opener on a Saturday BUT 10's of thousands of NY deer hunters can plan THEIR vacations next year based on a Saturday opener........
Please....I beg you...some one explain what I am missing?
MZ
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Post by trappermac on Aug 19, 2011 15:00:26 GMT -5
Please....I beg you...some one explain what I am missing? MZ Nothing at all...you said it in your first post..."Whitetails rule the world" I'd love the opener to be the Sat before the 25th. That way when I take my 5 vacation days following the opener I get a 9 day trapline out of it. Now when I take 5 days I only get a 7 day line out of it. Sign me up for it
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2011 15:03:05 GMT -5
Please....I beg you...some one explain what I am missing? MZ I think you already know what your missing, you picked the Red headed step child of out door sports. Would have figured you knew that. The real question is who pushed this legislation? Anyone?
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Post by Itrapny on Aug 19, 2011 15:54:31 GMT -5
Mark..did you read my post? I'm all for an earlier opening date...in fact, at the last BOD meeting when I brought this up I was about run out of town on a rail...lol
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Post by oakhilltrappin on Aug 19, 2011 16:48:35 GMT -5
Im with you AJ...how is it this flew in under the radar...never heard a word of it till it was signed !! So now i spend $100 on my super sportsman and they get to pick the deer i shoot ?? I keep sayin it , im gettin closer and closer to just buyin my trappin license and sayin piss on deer huntn all together !! Pretty sad when deer huntn was my first true love in the outdoors. What ever happened to the old days when we could leave our game laws alone for more than 2 years ??
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Post by furman1989 on Aug 19, 2011 17:41:37 GMT -5
Oakhill, in total agreement with ya, many a fellow on the verge of giving up on something they used to love to do. Gonna be hard to convince kids to join the ranks when their parents are bailing out.
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Post by BlackBearBill on Aug 20, 2011 4:47:43 GMT -5
Does anyone have a link to any story about this? I find nothing with goggle search or on DEC web site.
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Post by otter on Aug 20, 2011 8:55:33 GMT -5
If this pisses you guys off. Try googling Agenda 21 and see what the government has in store for you. Watch the nine minute utube video on it..Then see how you feel..
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Post by sthet on Aug 20, 2011 11:39:07 GMT -5
I first heard of the want for antler restrictions in the late 80s or early 90s. It was something that didn't make any sense to me. I have listened to people talking about this and it seems like they were split down the middle on if they were for it or against it. I could have never guessed that it would have been enacted by law. We pay good money, depending on who you talk to, for the educated and experience biologists to set the needs and standards on controlling our wildlife populations. Like Mark has stated much of what you hear goes into deaf ears, until something like this happens. Then nobody ever knew. We are lucky to have people, like Dave Miller, behind the scenes working to protect us. God forbid something happens to him, I hope there is someone who will be there to take over the job we have taken for granted.
I too believe that in order to fix our government we must vote everyone that is in office now out. This would only have to be done once or twice. They will get the message. Other than that we are controlled by the media, the politicians know how to manipulate the media to control the masses. The freedoms granted to us by God and our Constitution have been whittled away for over 100 years now to the point that being truly free is no longer expected, deemed worthy or necessary and any attempt at these freedoms will be meant with total opposition. All men are created equal, what you do with it from there is the difference. When it become obvious that we are no longer equal, laws will be passed supressing those that want to be the best they can be and making them equal to those that do not have the ambition to be anything. Those that we elect to run our government have proven they are not capable of the task and have rewritten your values for you to make you believe that they are. It is a game of control that needs to be stopped unless you are fluent in Chinese. If you are not fluent you need to start practicing now. In order for history not to repeat itself you must understand history and in order for you not to understand history it is being rewritten. Emotions cannot replace facts but they are everyday. Our children are not being educated to the point that they need to be so that they can reap the benefits a truly free society. They are taught just enough that they can be subservient and dependant on lack luster leadership. Step out of this mold and be ridiculed until you get back in line, or worse. All this can be stopped but not by waiting until after the fact or thinking that someone else will do it for you. The great freedoms of America are so envied that they must be removed so that the less furtunate can be equal. In my adult life I have not truely known the God given freedoms promised by our Constitution and more and more are taken every day.
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