|
Post by bobsamuelson on Jul 24, 2014 20:20:32 GMT -5
As I sat in our NYSTA board meeting, I looked around the room and a scary thought entered my mind! We are a bunch of old geezers! With the 'older guard' ( the past presidents) and the 'younger guard' (myself, Jim Greeley and others) it occurred to me 'Where are the young guys?' By that I mean those under 40!
We need some younger blood or soon NYSTA will be a distant memory! I am not sure what can be done to get more member participation, specifically the members of the younger generation, (which the Trappers Camp is helping with) .
I have been a member for quite some time, and a regional director for several years, and when I go to a board meeting, I see the same faces! (Nothing wrong with those faces!) When I have asked trappers if they are a member of NYSTA they always respond with, "What's in it for me? What do I get for my dues?" You get to continue to trap! Simple as that! If not for the current and past members of the NYSTA, trapping in NY would be nothing more than a memory that is told in stories around a camp fire!
There are about 10,000 licensed trappers in NY. Yet, there are less than 1800 members! I hate to sound negative, but really? That's the best we can do? When we are up against an issue that may or may not go against us, it is the same members putting up the fight for ALL trappers, not just those that are members! Strength in numbers! The antis have HUGE numbers and resources compared to us! Sure, we have science and facts on our side, but sometimes numbers will outweigh science!
We can do better, but we need more members! More members means we will have more financial resources to battle our foes! I truly believe that if we had an increase in membership by 150% possibly we could change the mentality that trapping is only a recreational activity! I know that I have put in a great deal of time and effort for someone to classify what I do as a hobby!
So, you younger trappers, get involved! Help out at the Convention for an hour or two, help out at one of the auctions that are held during the season but most of all, become a member and get involved before we are remembered as "Back in the day..."
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 24, 2014 20:39:21 GMT -5
Post by RLMcoyote7 on Jul 24, 2014 20:39:21 GMT -5
Bob, well said....the more people get involved the better we are as the members of the NYSTA.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 24, 2014 20:50:02 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by REDNECK on Jul 24, 2014 20:50:02 GMT -5
Well said and I try to help walt when I can and when I get to go to a convention I will help all I can and hope ro see ya soon
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 25, 2014 16:02:23 GMT -5
Post by herm on Jul 25, 2014 16:02:23 GMT -5
Bob,When I attented my first BOD Meeting years ago, one of the first things that came in my mine was how did some of these guys make it hear. At that time the board was made up of people even older than the present time. The old guard may have been old, but snow storms or what ever, they still managed to drive a distance to show up.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2014 20:31:54 GMT -5
Bob. Very well said. Would like permission to resend your message out to RCTA members, our Facebook members and Twitter followers.
M Finn Secretary
|
|
cooper67
#2 Newhouse
oswego county trappers ,nysta,jefferson county
Posts: 2,554
|
Wanted!
Jul 25, 2014 21:49:10 GMT -5
Post by cooper67 on Jul 25, 2014 21:49:10 GMT -5
So bob charlie was the youngest till squirrel killer came then was my self then you in age yes probably three under the age of 50 not good yes people should join to keep trapping rights in ny state.if not people would probably not be able to as the people from ny city would rather hug trees than have us helping to controll the population before the animals die of diseases that make it so they have no hair and freeze to death or starve. Help nysta by becoming a member .
|
|
paintedpaw
Retired NYSDEC Lake George Ranger
Posts: 691
|
Wanted!
Jul 26, 2014 19:34:28 GMT -5
Post by paintedpaw on Jul 26, 2014 19:34:28 GMT -5
I happen to be the oldest member of the Board of Directors. I've been a member of NYSTA for better than 50 years; dating back to the conventions held at Piseco Lake. Like Bob, I wish more younger men and women would join NYSTA and get involved. It's not just NYSTA, I see the average age of hunters getting up there into the gray hair bracket.I see a decline in membership in fraternal organizations like the Masons, and in Sportsmen clubs, even seeing smaller churches close.This is not the same country that I grew up in. Today people are more apt to stay home and watch the boob tube or play with all of these electronic devices; everything from I-Pads, cell phones, apps, texting, facebook, to God knows what. I would to get my grandson out throw all of those things in a lake! The culture has changed too. Go to a fur sale and guys come out of the woodwork. As soon as their fur is sold many of them are gone, not to be seen until next year! Everyone these days is out for me and to heck with you. What's in it for me? I think for twenty Five bucks you get quite a bargain. If for no other reason the magazine subscription comes close to that. Also periodically one gets the newsletter, "Traplines". Of great value is the fact that you are representedIn Albany with the legislature and Governor's Office. Without that alone anti-trapping bills would have shut us down years ago. In a state of some nineteen million people and only ten thousand trappers we have had to survive by our wits. Look at our neighbors; New Jersey and Massachusetts. Look at Western States like Colorado. Think it can't happen here?hink again! I've been a member of the JTI Committee for better than 25 years! We are the direct committee resposible for representing NYSTA with DEC. I've been through issues like the padded trap was hot, and the 330 issue, and the 220 issue as well. Some trappers were not happy with some of the outcomes, including me, but we had to look at the bigger picture, and the fact remains thatwe still are trapping in New York and a lot of other states are not. Also, through my membership and involvement in NYSTA I have life long frienshipswith people from all over New York as well as in other states too. I cherish those friendships! So I say to you that are not members, join, get involved, and you will find it is the best twenty five bucks you have ever spent. We gray dogs aint gonna be here forever!
|
|
|
Post by camohoyt340 on Jul 27, 2014 13:19:42 GMT -5
I was just wondering what the new 330 regulations are, that were talked about in the recent "traplines"?
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 13:36:57 GMT -5
Post by bobsamuelson on Jul 27, 2014 13:36:57 GMT -5
This was something I talked about when the 330 trigger regulation first came out. The regulation used the measurements from the standard 330 size body grip trap, which was 10 X 10, to set the regulation. However, soon it became apparent that Duke 330's were under the 10 X 10 restriction as they are 10 inches wide but only 9 inches high! Thus, if you were using Duke 330 size body gripping traps, you didn't need to comply with the trigger regulation! So now, to include ALL 330 size traps, the DEC is proposing changing the size restriction to 8 1/2 inches, thus bringing all 330 size traps into compliance! The regulation regarding 280's will not change.
We have to be aware that a manufacturers designation that a #1 is a #1 doesn't hold true! By that I mean the number designation by one manufacturer may be the same as another but may not be the same size trap! A perfect example is a #3 Bridger is not legal in NY with out inside laminations, whereas a #3 Duke is measured at 5 3/4, which makes it legal!
Bob Samuelson
|
|
|
Post by camohoyt340 on Jul 27, 2014 14:54:32 GMT -5
A number 3 duke measures less than 5.5 inside.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 15:00:18 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by jdpaint on Jul 27, 2014 15:00:18 GMT -5
What are the odds 280 will be next? How is the otter restoration going?
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 16:04:36 GMT -5
Post by saquelie on Jul 27, 2014 16:04:36 GMT -5
Any word on the fisher debacle.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 16:09:40 GMT -5
Post by trappermac on Jul 27, 2014 16:09:40 GMT -5
There are about 10,000 licensed trappers in NY. Yet, there are less than 1800 members! I hate to sound negative, but really? That's the best we can do? When we are up against an issue that may or may not go against us, it is the same members putting up the fight for ALL trappers, not just those that are members! Strength in numbers! The antis have HUGE numbers and resources compared to us! Sure, we have science and facts on our side, but sometimes numbers will outweigh science! We can do better, but we need more members! More members means we will have more financial resources to battle our foes! I truly believe that if we had an increase in membership by 150% possibly we could change the mentality that trapping is only a recreational activity! I know that I have put in a great deal of time and effort for someone to classify what I do as a hobby! ..." If those numbers are correct that's 18%, which is probably a good number as far as these types of organizations are concerned. That's not to say we shouldn't do better.....we should. I wonder comparatively how many gun owners are members of the NRA, trout fisherman members of Trout Unlimited, turkey hunters members of WTF, etc. I think when someone accepts a pursuit as part of their lifestyle, like many on here, they are more prone to become "members" of an organization that supports it. If they dabble in it, do a little of it but not something that shapes their thinking 12 months of the year, then they're far less likely to join. I've been a passionate flyfisherman for trout since I was a kid. I belong to TU. Some streams near me I've been involved in clean-ups, anti-erosion projects, assisted on shocking surveys, have planted trees along the banks, etc. But when I head out the 2nd week of the trout season to wet a line and see the streams crawling with folks trout fishing, I know that probably 99% of them don't even know TU exists....or care. It's just the way it is. Older members die, new members who share the passion join. Percentages remain the same or change very little.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 16:47:18 GMT -5
Post by bobsamuelson on Jul 27, 2014 16:47:18 GMT -5
saquelie, at this point it is being written, re-written and made presentable for inclusion into the Public Register. At this point, we have been given assurances that any type of bag limits or quotas will not be included. However, shortening the seasons in some areas is a distinct possibility! Shortening the season at the begining rather than the end would produce better fur quality, but may limit opportunities for some. We, NYSTA and the JTI committee, have expressed our thoughts on the whole topic, and to quote one of the members of the Furbearer Management Team, "...on quotas or bag limits, we hear you! Loud and clear!" So, when it is posted on the Public Register, there will be a post on here so you can read the proposal and comment on what the proposal contains.
|
|
|
Post by camohoyt340 on Jul 27, 2014 16:50:04 GMT -5
So the DEC made a regulation saying that 10x10 traps need the modified triggers. Then trappers (including me) bought traps that were smaller than 10x10 so the regulation didn't apply to them. Now they are trying to change the regulation just because the trap says "330"? What if duke called the trap the "329"? Would it still need to comply? We all know you cannot go by the trap number. Which is why the DEC clearly said all 10x10 traps need this "otter safe" trigger. My traps are not 10x10 so I don't see the issue.
That's like saying the biggest trap you can set on land is 5 3/4" or a number 2 size. Then realizing the duke 3 is less than 5 3/4". Then changing the regulation to say "only number 2 size traps can be set on land."
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 17:05:40 GMT -5
Post by bobsamuelson on Jul 27, 2014 17:05:40 GMT -5
The DEC was not happy when trappers changed to 280's to avoid the trigger regs! Then when they learned that there were trappers circumventing the regulation by buying the Duke 330's, they saw it as a loophole to close.
If those in the closed otter areas would comply with the intent, not catching otters, then they wouldn't be tweeking the reg! I don't know how many otters are caught in the Duke 330's as I don't know if anyone knows.
I don't like the reg any better than anyone else! But sometimes, we need to bend a little before we lose!
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 17:19:38 GMT -5
Post by jdpaint on Jul 27, 2014 17:19:38 GMT -5
Ya that losing more has me worried .If they think there are otter being caught ,they must have an idea of the population also.How many otter is enough or will these regs stay forever?I have a feeling that Duke 330 were being used not so much to catch otter on purpose but to get a better catch with smaller beaver.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 17:40:38 GMT -5
Post by saquelie on Jul 27, 2014 17:40:38 GMT -5
Thank you Bob for the update,I would love to see a fisher season the month of December
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 21:04:58 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by REDNECK on Jul 27, 2014 21:04:58 GMT -5
Whats wrong with the duke 330s I was told if u move your trigger 8 in to one side and wire your trigger wires together I was good I dont wont to get in a snag thanks
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 21:40:43 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by bobsamuelson on Jul 27, 2014 21:40:43 GMT -5
Brian, the trigger regulation was written to include all 330 size traps. The definition of a 330 size was understood to be 10 x 10. The regulation didn't account for the Duke 330's being 10 wide but only 9 high, thus not meeting the need for offset triggers! The DEC is only closing what they see as a loophole and will not affect 280's.
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 27, 2014 22:08:04 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by REDNECK on Jul 27, 2014 22:08:04 GMT -5
Well I have no problem doing it but i do not own one 330 but if I buy any they will duke thanks again for keeping me up to par on regs
|
|
|
Wanted!
Jul 28, 2014 7:48:30 GMT -5
Post by herm on Jul 28, 2014 7:48:30 GMT -5
Chances are the DEC got a lot of their information on how trappers were getting by the 330 reg. by using Duke traps was right on this web site. As far as the fisher study and plan, I have talked to many here in region 8. To the man, they do not really want them here in any great numbers and want the harvest season open as soon as possible.
|
|
paintedpaw
Retired NYSDEC Lake George Ranger
Posts: 691
|
Wanted!
Jul 28, 2014 13:00:26 GMT -5
Post by paintedpaw on Jul 28, 2014 13:00:26 GMT -5
I have to agree with Herm that far too much is said on this website and I am as guilty of that as anyone. I have never liked the 330 trigger regulation, but at this time I don't want to open another can of worms. I have already been very outspoken about the coming Fisher Management Plan. I really can not comment on Herm's attitude towards fisher in the southern tier as I'm a north country resident. I do think Bob Samuelson has put things in perspective very well.
|
|
|
Post by walleyed on Jul 28, 2014 14:04:10 GMT -5
The DEC was not happy when they learned that there were trappers circumventing the regulation by buying the Duke 330's, they saw it as a loophole to close. If those in the closed otter areas would comply with the intent, not catching otters, then they wouldn't be tweeking the reg! I don't know how many otters are caught in the Duke 330's as I don't know if anyone knows. As a rule, I don't Trap Beaver in Southern Zone being primarily a Northern Zone trapper, but still, I own about 3 dozen Duke 10 X 9 "330's". My ONLY Intent when buying these DUKE 10 X 9's is that they are CHEAP, AFFORDABLE TRAPS that don't break the budget. I have no legitimate reason to avoid otter in the Northern Zone during our open Beaver/Otter season, so I am not trying to circumvent anything, and I suspect Many Southern Zone Trappers are buying DUKE 10 x 9's for the same reason......THEY ARE CHEAP. (The Trap and the Trapper) There Does not Always have to be a "Conspiracy" to violate the "Intent" or "Spirit" of the 330 Trigger Regulation. It is just as likely many Southern Tier Trappers are buying DUKE 10 X 9's because they are cheap, not because they don't want to mess with trigger regulations, or are purposely targeting otter. Otter can potentially be incidentally taken in most any size of body grip so unless you are going to disallow beaver trapping entirely with these traps, you are going to have a small, unavoidable, percentage of accidental mortality no matter what. The DEC Bureau of Wildlife was already Well Aware in advance of this fact, long before the Otter Restoration began, and have taken this incidental mortality into consideration in formulating Their Otter Restoration Management Plan for the Southern Zone. w
|
|
|
Post by tony1967 on Jul 28, 2014 14:20:25 GMT -5
I agree. We ran almost all Duke 330's and still offset the trigger per the regs.
|
|