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Post by papabear on Jan 18, 2014 11:16:04 GMT -5
Dear fellow Fisher trappers, I'm sure you too, received a packet from NYS DEC, requesting information regarding "Fisher Harvest Locations" between 2005-2013 with an enclosed set of maps........First let me state that I am not completely opposed to providing the requested information. However I am a tad curious why they want to know "harvest LOCATIONS". The packets' cover letter explains its reason is to " better understand fisher habitat".........now my questions to you are; 1) what's your thoughts and opinion, 2) and how many of you are going to provide the requested information............ Please understand it is not my intent to solicit derogatory comments aimed at the NYS DEC in this thread. Also I respectfully request the moderators delete any posts that bash the NYS DEC......Regards
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Post by woodsdweller on Jan 18, 2014 11:56:35 GMT -5
I know they are doing a study here as I live close to the line. I took in some beaver to them a few weeks ago and the study is going well and numbers are up in these areas. my thoughts are they may be trying to see a more specific area than just a town where they were harvested. thinking positive here, who better to ask than they guys doing it.
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Post by nightstalker1 on Jan 18, 2014 12:24:16 GMT -5
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Post by bobsheedy on Jan 18, 2014 12:48:08 GMT -5
If it's a honest appraisal of population, take, and trends, then I'm for it. We would have to ask Gordon. Maybe Dave Miller and John Rockwood could find out what's behind the survey other than to "better understand fisher habitat".........
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Post by brandonh on Jan 18, 2014 15:37:00 GMT -5
spoke with paul jenson about this.. he said he wants this information to correlate with the marten harvest and to see the relationship between marten and fisher at a micro location level.. those who are familiar with marten permit process know that you must mark on the map where these marten werè taken.. i guess this paperwork is a mirror image.
i joked to paul that he could run one heck of a fisher line once he accumulates this fisher info- so if he we dont see him in the office this fall, we will know why hahaha
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Post by puppyd on Jan 18, 2014 16:07:40 GMT -5
Is it only the region 5 trappers they asked to volunteer to pinpoint their fisher catches on the maps? I think so.
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Post by brushwolf64 on Jan 18, 2014 18:16:30 GMT -5
Im guessing that it might be to see if any densities of population exist in those areas. Kind of like what they are doing with the fisher study and trail cams but with actual catch sites. If they had enough trappers commit to this then they could look and see where the larger portion of the catch comes from and study those areas/habitat. Just a guess on my part though.
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paintedpaw
Retired NYSDEC Lake George Ranger
Posts: 691
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Post by paintedpaw on Jan 18, 2014 18:24:35 GMT -5
I provided those locations to Paul at the Foothills Fur Sale. I know that DEC is workig on a Fisher Management Plan, expected first draft this spring. We are seeing a dramatic decline in the Central and Eastern Adirondacks while at same time seeing a population explosion in central New York and the southern tier. Why? Many opinions.My opinion is Fisher are where the feed is and it is not in the Adirondacks!
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Post by camohoyt340 on Jan 18, 2014 19:36:07 GMT -5
I have caught and released a few fishers this year. I'm also in the bobcat expansion area. When I talked to the DEC officer who seals my pelts he wanted to know the exact location of my catches.
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Post by saquelie on Jan 18, 2014 20:32:42 GMT -5
Still say region 5 needs a good burn.
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Post by saquelie on Jan 18, 2014 20:33:16 GMT -5
Still say region 5 needs a good burn.
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Post by papabear on Jan 18, 2014 20:40:08 GMT -5
I provided those locations to Paul at the Foothills Fur Sale. I know that DEC is workig on a Fisher Management Plan, expected first draft this spring. We are seeing a dramatic decline in the Central and Eastern Adirondacks while at same time seeing a population explosion in central New York and the southern tier. Why? Many opinions.My opinion is Fisher are where the feed is and it is not in the Adirondacks! Dear Mr. Paintedpaw, I am aware and have been noticing the same. My concern is if the biologists conclude a declining catch rate in these areas are they going to reccomend a closure of the season in those areas......I am in complete agreement that fisher are migrating to areas that have a sustainable food supply. What's it going to take to convince " those in charge" that the environment / mature forests are the root of declining animal populations. What's it going to take to convince the Forever Wild faction that forest management is truely a good thing, not only for the health of the forests but also for creating sustaining habitat for wildlife. Why would the state not want to capitalize on a renewable resource, create revenues, jobs, and perhaps even reduce the tax burden for its residents. Selective and properly managed logging would do wonders for all the above mentioned. It is inevitable that if left Forever Wild, the woodlands will become sterile/ void of all wildlife and trapping and hunting seasons won't matter............I'm not sure if I want to participate in something that could possibly restrict me from trapping fisher in areas that I have trapped and have established over the years. These same areas used to have healthy populations of bobcat but anymore a bobcat is a rare catch, but still the season remains open for which I am grateful in case one happens by.....Another factor that I am convinced influences the fall fisher shuffle in the Adirondacks is fisher season runs concurrently with deer gun season. I am convinced if fisher season Started around Thanksgiving and ran until the end of December the biologists numbers would be a whole lot different and find that a later season would not be any more detrimental to the fisher population than what the current season are......I have filled out informational surveys in the past, and even reported otter sightings here in the Mohawk Valley and never once have I received a conclusion/ results of any of them. I quit calling in otter sightings because no one ever called back to verify that these calls useful or even being used. Got me to thinking what's the use.........Regards
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Post by saquelie on Jan 18, 2014 21:15:01 GMT -5
Sir Papa have you seen a decline in red and grey squirrels in your area. Seems around my area i very seldom see a red anymore and no were near the numbers of greys.
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tmc
#2 Newhouse
Posts: 2,447
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Post by tmc on Jan 18, 2014 21:38:48 GMT -5
Well, our place in Forestport has never had any grey squirrels to speak of, but reds and chickorees are abundant and always have been. I'm talking about a little under 400 acres with several hundred acres of state forest adjacent to it.
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Post by broadhorizons on Jan 18, 2014 21:53:20 GMT -5
My concern is if the biologists conclude a declining catch rate in these areas are they going to reccommend a closure of the season in those areas Now that is a good reason to question their motive!
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Post by papabear on Jan 18, 2014 22:01:49 GMT -5
Dear Mr.Saquelie, In most of the areas I trap fisher, I seldom see grey squirrels, however there always seems to be healthy populations of red squirrels and chipmunks and voles. Over the past two seasons I've noticed a nice increase in the snowshoe hare population ...and yes my fisher catch is off at these locations.........however I'm not yet convinced the fisher numbers are down at these locations as I've seen fisher tracks in the snow at most of them....I'm thinking the fisher (being an efficient hunter) merely prefers a hot rabbit dinner instead of a cold frozen chunk of meat. Regards
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traps82
#3 Newhouse
Hope is always alive
Posts: 3,208
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Post by traps82 on Jan 18, 2014 22:40:28 GMT -5
Don't know what to make of this.. I know what my gut says.
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paintedpaw
Retired NYSDEC Lake George Ranger
Posts: 691
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Post by paintedpaw on Jan 19, 2014 9:27:18 GMT -5
Dear Mr. Pappa-Bear, I think your statement is one of the most intelligent and well written on this matter. Regarding the "Forever Wild" Adirondacks it is sad that the lack of management seems to be controlled by the environmental groups. Your arguments for controlled logging and forest management fall upon deaf ears. I fear a season closure after watching the very long term otter closure in the Catskills and Mohawk Valley.That season still has not reopened! Would not want to see that happen with fisher. I also do not want to see catch limits as that can be abused very easily, and it goes against my grain. Your proposal to run the season from Thanksgiving to the end of December is right on the money. The study DEC did a few years back in St.Lawrence County confirmed that a later season does not create a negative effect.If the New England states can run later fisher seasons why can't we?
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traps82
#3 Newhouse
Hope is always alive
Posts: 3,208
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Post by traps82 on Jan 19, 2014 9:42:44 GMT -5
^^^ And the fur is even MORE beautiful later on- I would like a season after deer season
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Post by alleganyderek on Jan 19, 2014 12:58:54 GMT -5
Here in WNY where the bobcat expansion was this year I believe we are starting to get a healthy population of fishers. Last year I caught and released 8. This year lots of tracks but left the gusto in the shed and haven't caught any. We used to have many grey and black squirrels now the only place you see then is in town. Same with porcupines. They are gone, believe this is due to the fisher. Really hope they give us a fisher expansion season here but would like to see it and the bobcat season started after deer season when they are fully prime.
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Post by camohoyt340 on Jan 19, 2014 13:25:51 GMT -5
I hear ya. It sure is no fun releasing fishers and bobcats.
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Post by alleganyderek on Jan 19, 2014 13:34:49 GMT -5
I didn't mind releasing them it's just that sooner or later your going to get one hurt. Then you dispatch it and the DEC incenerates it. Just seems like a waste and disrespect for the animal. As does harvesting them when they are not prime.
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Post by papabear on Feb 28, 2015 9:46:43 GMT -5
Dear Friends, Remember this one! Regards
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traps82
#3 Newhouse
Hope is always alive
Posts: 3,208
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Post by traps82 on Feb 28, 2015 10:31:41 GMT -5
Yeppers
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Post by mikemason on Feb 28, 2015 13:05:01 GMT -5
Does any one know the acreage consumed by DEC over the last 20 years in the central and eastern ADKs that were once producive timber land?
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